Episode Transcript

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[00:00:00] Intro Theme (Music by Danya Vodovoz)
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[00:00:30] Introduction and Catching Up
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DJ Sir Daniel: Greetings and welcome back to another exciting episode of Queue Points podcast. I am DJ Sir Daniel.

Jay Ray: And my name is Jay Ray, sometimes known by my government as Johnnie Ray Kornegay III, what's happening people.

DJ Sir Daniel: Jay Ray,

how are you feeling, bro?

Jay Ray: I'm feeling good. My voice is a little raspy. I think I have a sinus sitch happening, but,

DJ Sir Daniel: around a lot

Jay Ray: it's going around. Also, let me tell you, we got to put our masks back on. Like when I'm going to like appointments and doctor's appointments, COVID is out here.

DJ Sir Daniel: the block. Absolutely. COVID is back and better than before as if that was possible but

Jay Ray: How are you?

DJ Sir Daniel: As usual, I'm back to my old shenanigans. I'm feeling good. Warrior Mama, we see you. Mark McPherson, so glad to see you guys are safe and here. But tonight. We got it going on, Jerry. We got a lot to catch up on and we have our, our, um, topic this evening is something that's been on the everybody's lips for the past few weeks, including Boosie.

And, um,

we are

Jay Ray: so many thoughts when we get to the, that

DJ Sir Daniel: you know, of course, we're going to talk about the color purple, the musical, and we're going to talk things. We're going to talk about Broadway musicals as it relates to Um, Black music and our lives, of course. So, oh, and we're going to talk about all of that other stuff too. We're, we're going to get to all of that.

[00:02:09] How to stay connected to Queue Points
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DJ Sir Daniel: So before we do that, let's just get the housekeeping out of the way. J Ray, please let our, our people know how they can maintain contact with us and keep up with the mess.

Jay Ray: yes. So, um, first things first, welcome everybody. Y'all are doing the thing that y'all, that helps us the most. And that is tuning in, listening, wherever you are listening or watching the show. That is important. So just go ahead and hit the subscribe button so that, uh, you can get notified whenever we go live or have a show or anything like that, that is completely free.

Also share it with your friends and family. That is completely free as well. If you like Queue Points, they will like Queue Points too. And it helps us to spread the word about the show. So that's super dope. You could join our, um. You can join our mailing list as well. So make sure that you do that. You can become a Queue Points insider that gives you some other stuff.

We only send that email out like once a month, sometimes twice. Um, but it gives you some additional kind of behind the scenes stuff. Our Queue Points magazine is poppin like Queue Points magazine is it's its own entity Over. Thank you so much. We are having so much fun with that so you can certainly go over there and also subscribe so you can get Queue Points magazine in your inbox and Last but not least you can support us by Purchasing merch.

So if you visit our store at store. cuepoints. com, you can purchase merch. The exciting thing is this year. I'm so excited. I can't wait to start launching our merch. We're going to have a new merch more frequently in 2024. And we're so excited. So, yo, y'all need to get up on it because it's about to go down, but those are all the ways to stay connected to Queue Points.

DJ Sir Daniel: Perfection. So do as J Ray said, and now so that we can keep these lights on over here. And of course, indulge in these conversations, these music based conversations.

[00:04:10] Transition
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[00:04:17] Topic: Broadway on Film: Dreamgirls and The Color Purple
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Jay Ray: So one of the things that as we were kind of closing out last year, we knew that the color purple was coming out because it was baby the moment the strike was over. Oprah called on her phone and she said, get everybody on the plane kids and people started promoting because it was color purple time.

Um,

DJ Sir Daniel: Who employed today?

Jay Ray: they, and baby, you can't tell me that Oprah didn't get that strike done, right? You can't tell me that Oprah didn't end the strike. Um. But we were talking about like, yo, the importance of Broadway shows and, and those Broadway shows that become then movies. Right. And, um, one of the first ones that we ended up talking about was dream girls.

Um, which of course is almost 20 years old. This is the, that movie is 18 years old now. And of course the film was based on the 1980s, the early 1980s Broadway hit musical that starred Cheryl Lee Ralph, Loretta Devine, and the Jennifer Holliday. These are household names in Black culture, right? They starred in this, this Broadway show that I never got a chance to see on Broadway, but.

It was important that that show and that story, then it made its way to the movies, but sir, Daniel, what is your memory of dream girls as a kid?

DJ Sir Daniel: So, um, as you all know, I grew up in New York in the early eighties, late seventies, early eighties, and Broadway is Like the industry that keeps New York running. It attracts tourists from all over the world. People come from everywhere to see a Broadway play in New York city. So you're going to see commercials.

All day long, ad nauseum, about some Broadway play. There was a time where I can, I would hear, I can hear the cue of a song and know, oh, that's from Cats. Because the Cats commercials was running all the time. Les Mis, I knew that one 20 second clip, I knew the 20 seconds that would play from Les Mis. on the commercial.

And I don't know those verses to that. And you name it. And so Dreamgirls was no different. And I just remember the coming to the Broadway theater. And it would be that same commercial with their fingers pointing out one night only one night only. And Shirley Ralph and Jennifer Holliday and Loretta Devarn starring Dreamgirls.

And I just remember seeing that commercial ad nauseum as a child. And just think, just being completely aware of Dreamgirls, but never actually having seen it myself. Uh, later on, of course, as I got older, I became familiar with the songs associated with Dreamgirls, like all of us. And then to experience the, experience the movie in 2005, um, And knowing that those, this new cast had those major shoes to fill was very exciting, especially when it came to Jennifer Hudson, you know, that movie was squarely on her shoulders and she shared, she did share some of the weight with Beyonce, but that movie was squarely on her shoulders because people wanted to see what was going to happen with the runner up.

Jay Ray: Yes.

DJ Sir Daniel: From an American idol because she didn't win American. So they were going to was what's going to happen with Jennifer Hudson. And here she had this moment and she took that moment all the way to the Oscars

Jay Ray: Yeah. The movie I remember, um. So leading up to the film, Beyonce was of course the bigger star, like she was the, the more, let me say that differently, she was the more well known contemporary star, Anika Noni Rose is already a star on Broadway, like she is, like we know her. Um,

DJ Sir Daniel: all of that.

Jay Ray: All of that. Right. Jenna, to your point, that was the, the thing with Jennifer Hudson was like, okay, so what's Jennifer going to do?

But everybody was, it was Beyonce was being set up as like the thing. And so it was funny when I went to see dream girls. Um, and I was like, the moment that Effie appeared on screen, I was like, Oh, she's eating. Right now, when she walks in there, the where's Effie and Effie showed up, it was very clear what this, what, what Jennifer, what Jennifer Hudson was going to get

DJ Sir Daniel: Yeah. And, you know, shout out to them, to all three of those women to, to, to drive, to be in the driver's seat of that movie, of that, of that huge, huge institution of a franchise. Dreamgirls is a franchise.

Jay Ray: Um,

DJ Sir Daniel: a Jamie Foxx who was at the height of his superpowers by the time that movie came on because he had already won an Oscar for Ray.

He was already a huge recording star at that point, you know, hobnobbing with Tom Cruise and later stole his wife. And then, you know. And was this the hot guy in Hollywood. So it was just a perfect storm for a perfect situation. Um, Jerry, what was your favorite number from the film?

Jay Ray: so it was funny. So Sir Daniel and I, um, And we had some, you know, folks that would pop in and joined us. We actually watched dream girls together and we're going to do more of that too. So look out for that. Like we, you might get a chance to watch stuff with us. Right? So we watched dream girls together and I had not seen it in a long time.

I can't remember the last time I actually saw dream girls. So. Ooh, this is hard. Okay. So my choice, my favorite number, I'm actually looking at the numbers. Cause okay. So yeah, my favorite number is definitely, I think it's move actually move, which is of course the first song that the dreams perform, um, or they do dream it's at the time, but anyway, they were the dream that's then, and.

I like the energy of the song. Um, Jennifer Hudson, of course, leads that joint and, um, the energy of the song I really, really love. Um, and even then I love it, it performed in the film. So I think that's my favorite number. What's your favorite number?

DJ Sir Daniel: Hands down. Step into the dark side.

Jay Ray: Who

DJ Sir Daniel: ooh. Ooh, there's just something about that, you know, the, first of all, it was the combination of the song and the choreography because Fatima Robinson, Fatima Robinson put her whole foot. All the way up to her elbow into that choreography for that whole movie And yes step into the dark side and

Jay Ray: step into the bad side.

[00:11:57] The Toxicity in Dreamgirls
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DJ Sir Daniel: Is it I don't know why I keep saying dark look i'm getting dream girls and star wars mixed up But step into the bad side, excuse me, y'all but yeah, that's my favorite number from dream girls and um, yeah if you Are, was it as invested in Dreamgirls, either the play or the movie?

My question for you then is who is actually the most toxic person in Dreamgirls? Was it Curtis? Was it Effie or was it Dina? And I think a lot of people, uh, well, I can't speak for a lot of people. I'll speak for myself. I will say after watching Dreamgirls again, a couple of times over the holidays. Well, it's kind of hard because they were all equally terrible. They were all equally terrible to each other at certain points, and especially when the money and the fame became got involved. But I think, I think the most problematic. If Dina had not started messing around with Curtis, at least, you know, try her darndest not to sleep with him or become romantically involved with him.

If she would have stuck to the girl code. I don't think that maybe the trajectory of their careers would have gone a different place

Jay Ray: that. I respect that. I think the most toxic and this character was just an awful character. I think Curtis is a despicable character. Um, it's in, in, in, in, we were watching the film and it was like, Oh, child, you was just awful for the beginning. Like if somebody is doing all of that talking and they got an answer and they already got your life planned out, run, run for the hill.

Um, but yeah, no, for me, I definitely think Curtis, uh, was the most toxic character. Um, what about y'all? I'm curious to know. For folks that are either watching us live or if you're listening to this show, um, let us know. Who do you think is the most toxic character. Um, I do want to mention something, sir.

Daniel before, uh, as we talk about this film, because I didn't realize this until I was researching for the movie. I did not own the dream girl soundtrack. Um, I didn't own it. So I didn't, uh, I never looked at the liner notes. So the soundtrack was produced by the underdogs. Um, which is, uh, like Harvey Mason Jr and, um, what's the, Oh, the brother that was married to, uh, uh, Kim Kardashian, um, is one of the underdogs, Damon Thomas.

I think he was married to, correct me if I'm wrong, y'all. I think Damon Thomas at one point was married to Kim Kardashian. Um. Yes, that I think that was definitely a thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, this is a thing. Um, yeah, they were, they were together at some point in the past. That was her first marriage. So anyway, he was part of the underdogs with Harvey Mason Jr.

Of course, Harvey Mason Jr. is now head of the Grammys. Um, so we get to see him a lot now, but they produced this soundtrack. You mentioned, um, Fatima Robinson as the choreographer. Um, so this movie just had so much going for it and, and the, it looked beautiful, like it was a beautifully shot film.

DJ Sir Daniel: So, I mean, just polished, the colors popped, um, the costuming, the hair, it just all worked. It was just. It just all worked. And we can't forget about the genius.

[00:16:12] Eddie Murphy: The Comedy Superstar
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DJ Sir Daniel: We had this conversation about comedians on the other side of the show, and we can't go without talking about Eddie Murphy who hands down ruled the eighties.

As a comedian, and movie star, and just an all around superstar, Eddie Murphy was it. And he proved, this was like a really big moment for Eddie Murphy because he had, it had been like a huge gap between like the Doctor Dolittle movies and what was happening now in Dreamgirls. And this was a, this was a dramatic role.

And he's saying, because a lot of, I think a lot of people forgot that Eddie Murphy can actually sing and had a whole singing career recording career outside of movies and, um, comedy. So I thought it was very important that we, we bring him up. If we want to talk about the comedy greats, that is a comedy superstar.

Eddie Murphy is like, he's set in stone as far as like the bar for comedy. Music and acting. So we couldn't go any further without, without mentioning Eddie Murphy and the story, like you were mentioning Curtis and his character is just the embodiment of everything that we talk about on Queue Points as it relates to the music industry.

Jay Ray: Yes.

[00:17:35] Why 'Dreamgirls' Still Resonates Today
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DJ Sir Daniel: So J Ray, why do you think this story still resonates? And it's so important. And so matters to this day.

Jay Ray: Um, I think it is, uh, it is a story about women getting from up under the, the, the foot and the thumb of controlling men who don't mean them no good. And when we, it is one of the things, like you just said, we talk about on this show all the time. I think these folk, these, these, these women found their power.

Right. And, and, um, we're able to like, listen, if I need to start again, I'll start again, but that's more important than staying here and being part of this. Um, I think it's so, so critical. So I think it resonates because it's kind of a universal story. And interestingly enough, similar to the next film that we're going to talk about.

Right. Um, but that's why I think it matters so much. What about you?

DJ Sir Daniel: Uh, there are, it's chock full of life lessons, you know, just like you were saying, um, the universal story about the importance of. Loyalty and friendship and not crossing lines. It's just so many. And I, I think it was also important because it has a historical context to it as well. And specifically for us here on Queue Points, you know, dropping the needle on Black music history.

It very well tells the story of how Black artists and Black artistry was treated in relation to their white counterparts and the things that Black artists had to be forced to do to get a leg up in the entertainment industry. So I think that resonates still to this day to people who are trying to break into the music industry.

So that's why this is something that's just going to be in our. Cultural canon forever. And just the Broadway play itself and this music, this television, television, this movie, a version of dream girls will both garner so much respect and will continue to have long lasting effects. On our, on us as a community forever.

Jay Ray: You know, I'm, I'm curious, uh, Sir Daniel to, well, one thing I want to do is I do want to shout out, uh, Sayida Garrett too, cause that Love You I Do, that song,

DJ Sir Daniel: That was my second song. That was my second song. Yes.

Jay Ray: one? My second one, I think, uh, actually is Dreamgirls. I really like Dreamgirls as a song.

DJ Sir Daniel: It's fun.

Jay Ray: Yeah, and shout out to Mark McPherson who said the F.

E. White version of One Night Only, that is a great song. There's a bunch of great songs in this movie. So I just wanted to, to, to definitely shout out, because I love a Saida Garrett. We probably just need to talk about Saida on the show at some point soon. Um, but I also wanted to honor the fact that prior to Dream Girls.

I hadn't seen in, in, in that period of time, like a ton of Black musicals. There hadn't been a lot in the nineties, right? So Dream Girls was kind of bringing that back into. The, you know, the, the universe, um, and I think it's important. I think it's just an important way to tell stories because of the way that we do music.

Um, I love the fact that they leaned into, they, it was a musical and we loved it for that.

[00:21:33] MPN Network Mid-Roll Ad
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[00:22:56] The Color Purple: A New Perspective
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DJ Sir Daniel: Welcome back to Queue Points podcast, We are continuing our conversation about the color purple. Um, movie that just dropped and right now we're in this space of discussing the importance of Black musicals because this is, these are the stages where a lot of these fantastic movies actually started out.

Jay Ray: So I, I am curious what are, what are your thoughts? On this adaptation of the Color Purple one, when, when did you see it and what was that experience like in the theater for you?

[00:23:31] The Impact of 'The Color Purple' Musical
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DJ Sir Daniel: So, um, I sought the day after christmas Um, I went with my best friend daryl um It was just, we were, so we were the first ones in the theater and we were kind of surprised. Where is everybody? This movie about to start. Where is everybody? And sure enough, when the lights dimmed, A flood of people just came in and started filling up the seats.

Um, and then we, you know, of course, we're ready to be transported to, to the, the, the, the coast of Georgia and I'm immediately taken in by the colors, the colors, the, the, the, the magnitude of everything that's on the screen, which is something that. The original, the 1985, 85 movie had, it was very, um, colorful visits, just a burst of colors on the screen.

And the, I think I was looking forward to the, I knew there was going to be a heaviness. I was surprised at how much I laughed and how much joy there was actually in, you know, the scenes between the two sisters leading up to the, their separation. I, you know, I knew it was coming, but I really enjoyed their singing together and their, their, their walking together and teaching.

You could tell there was real love between them. And I have to say, I didn't even know that was Deon Cole at first. So the first 10 minutes I was like, Oh, that's Deon Cole

Jay Ray: He came to play. I was like, oh, that's who that is

DJ Sir Daniel: was completely transformed. And just my overall opinion was I loved it. Um, I Fatima Robinson, of course, again, this really just.

[00:25:38] The Magic of Stage Performances
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DJ Sir Daniel: Really gave this you can see you could see Fatima in the choreography. I could see moments of Aaliyah I could see moments of you know Other people Mary J. Blige other people that she is choreographed for I can see kind of those those movements that gave it a modern feel, but it was still a time period, a time period piece.

And not for nothing, I know everybody has been talking about Fantasia, but not for nothing, Taraji P. Henson, really, she really came in there and killed it with her, her Suge Avery singing scenes. I don't think, I think again, Like Eddie Murphy, a lot of people don't realize that she has a voice and she can actually sing.

And I was blown away by her performance. I really was, and I really loved David Alan Greer as

Jay Ray: Oh, my goodness. I didn't even know David Allen Greer could do what he was doing. And okay, so let's talk. So let's talk about this music, right? So this film has some of the most beautiful music I've heard. So once again, you know, there's the through line, right? We got two through lines actually through line from Dreamgirls is Fatima and then the through line in the music is Quincy Jones because Quincy Jones did the music for the first one, produced the first one and did the music for it.

And then he did the produced this one and did the music for it as well. Um, and what I love. So much, so much is how the music transcended. Like these are music videos. These are like each one of these scenes can be its own music video, right? It is. One part, uh, period performance and another part, to your point about Fatima and the choreography, contemporary music because of the way it looks, because of the way they're performing it and the way that they're singing it.

Um, that Tamela Man intro.

[00:27:57] The Significance of Black Representation in Theater
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Jay Ray: With the mysterious ways

DJ Sir Daniel: Yes,

Jay Ray: I was like, Oh, this is what we about to do. Okay. Take me. I'm ready.

DJ Sir Daniel: you know that sugar every coming to town scene as well

Jay Ray: Baby. Wasn't that something?

DJ Sir Daniel: like those kids really came in there You know else struck me the the the the the variation of bodies that were performing As not just, not the people that were the front, the, the leads, but the dancers, I saw a variation in bodies of people that were up there moving.

And it's not, not only in this, in this movie, but I noticed in the Kennedy sensor honors. As well as a lot of different award shows. Now they're expanding the types of bodies and people that you will see dancing in these productions, which I was blown away. And I was like, man, these people are keeping up and it looks right.

It looks like it belongs. They, and that's what they, people have been trying to tell you from, from, from a long time ago is that these people belong in these productions as well. So I think, you know, some people might think that's being woke and pushing D E I and diversity and inclusion and whatnot, but it works.

That's the whole point is you need to see that these things work and everybody belongs.

Jay Ray: Um, absolutely agree. And I think even looking at the casting for this film, there was, I felt like there was care. Taken and the people that play each of the roles, you know what I'm saying? Like even going to when you get to the end of the film and see, I did not know Sierra was going to be The the grown up the grown up sister.

I did not know that. Um

DJ Sir Daniel: funny. I'm not, I can't even lie. That was hilarious. That was a little hilarious.

Jay Ray: You know, I was I did not I was more concerned I'm not going i'm not going to shade her like that. I'm not going to shade her like that what what i'm happy about Is that they gave her a moment, she got a little, she got to, you know, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop, whoop a little bit next to Fantasia, which is not easy, baby, because Fantasia was going to give you vocal this entire movie, right?

And they got a Sierra got to sing next to Fantasia, and I think that is really important. That will be really important for Sierra. Um, but I do want to go real back. I want to go back to, uh, that Taraji P. Henson,

DJ Sir Daniel: Yes.

Jay Ray: because one of the things, and this is outside of the music. And I mentioned this to Kipper. I was talking to Kipper Jones today.

Suge Avery brought color to that town. Like it was amazing watching when Suge arrived, how. I felt like everything was brighter. It wasn't just Sealy. It was Mr. Two. It was the whole town having this like jolt of, of rebel energy in this, like there and present that really just like filled me up every time Taraji was on the screen, because I felt like she emote, like she just.

Aided up and really, really gave us some really bright moments in this movie. Yeah,

DJ Sir Daniel: did. I think that, you know, it's so funny how the things that are going on with her personally and professionally are kind of are parallel to all of the characters. In the color purple and even the characters in dream girls that we hearken back to that and how important it is to again, like I was saying to support people to support artists and Because they really do lay it all on the line everybody on that set Laid everything out laid everything out for Those characters to come to life for us to, to come away 40 years later, hating Mr, hating his guts, the Danny Glover version to come now to 2024 and be able to, in this version where they specifically tried to humanize him.

Jay Ray: him. They resolved

DJ Sir Daniel: And give a resolve is something that actually could be, uh, lent to how we navigate the world, the real world. And I think, I don't know if they, if they knew that that was going to happen with this project, but that's the kind of magic that art Gives us that art creates and so Man, there's so much to say about the different parts.

Now. Here's something I do want to um discuss So when fantasia had her big number

I

Jay Ray: I'm here.

DJ Sir Daniel: i'm here So what I did notice I was like, hmm. I noticed the reaction in the theater Was dry in comparison to Jennifer Hudson's, I am telling you moment in dream girls and I, I just thought that was really, it was very interesting to me then what, but one of my friends, um, I think it was Michonne, Michonne Simon brought it to my attention and, and, and put it out and say, I am as popular as I'm still here as popular as what is because of the musical just does not have the legacy of, I am telling you, I am telling you has a life of its own.

on completely, completely. And that was a light bulb moment. I was like, you're absolutely right. I'm telling you is can be sung in a high school talent show. It's being lip synced to at a drag brunch. It's being performed. On this movie, it has a life of its own outside of the play and outside of the movie.

[00:34:58] The Color Purple: A Deeper Dive
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DJ Sir Daniel: And so it, that was just an interesting observation that I had because like I said, Fantasia is definitely being set up for the Oscar noms, all the Golden Globe noms,

Jay Ray: them all to her.

DJ Sir Daniel: that's coming her way because she really did. And I think it's a story. Behind, like the parallels between a Fantasia and a Seelie, you know, coming up in this nasty business, having this talent, but people trying to keep you under their thumb is, you know, it was like typecasting.

It was like their role was made for her. And I thought it was so interesting that she didn't even want to do it because of how heavy it was. To her, for her to play it on Broadway. So just a couple of observations I had regarding those two moments. I was like, okay, so this is her big moment. This is the big song.

This is what they're going to be, um, submitting to all the, the, the, the, the, um, the, the Oscar. People to the Golden Globe people. This is what we're submitting to you for consideration for this award. And that's how it did. They did that for Jennifer and dream girls. And yeah, so I was just like, Ooh, this is, this didn't land here in the theater.

Like when I was at the movie theaters, people were standing on their feet and giving a standing ovation during a movie and almost missed out on dialogue because people were still clapping after Jennifer Hudson was finished singing. I am telling you.

Jay Ray: You know, so when I saw, um, the color purple, cause I only saw it, I saw it last night. So I went last night and we, and there was, you know, it was a very light theater. I will say the moment in I'm here and I, and, and catch it was the moment. When, uh, Celie broke the fourth wall and was looking right at us and pointing at, at me, I was like, Oh, wow, she's talking to me.

[00:37:05] The Power of Music in Storytelling
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Jay Ray: She's talking to all of us right now. I definitely agree that that song just doesn't have the same legacy. Right. Um, but. That thing, that entire performance, that release of Celie from the bondage that she had been in to this new version. Um, that's also, and I have to say, part of it, Sir Daniel could be, by the time we get to that point, baby, these women have been through a lot.

the time we get to, I'm here, you're like, baby, whoo. I'm just happy we got to this point because it, the, the, the film kind of changes to, you know, we get to experience a little more lightness than we get. So I think that's part of it is it's like, we've been in the grips of this. This time when Celia is with this man and all of this stuff, it's all baby.

Sophia's in jail, Sophia in jail. I was like, I Lord Jesus. I

DJ Sir Daniel: You know.

you wanna hear something weird? For, there was, there was so many moments of lightness that I really thought, Hmm, I wonder if they are gonna leave that out and it's just understood that Sofia didn't go to jail. Cause I was really thinking, Oh, we gonna keep, this is gonna be light. But no, they still had it and it was still very poignant and a very important, um, part of the story,

[00:38:48] Have we been holding on to our memories of The Color Purple?[00:38:48] Transition
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DJ Sir Daniel: you, you brought something to me.

I had an aha moment. I think we have been holding on to the memory of the 1985. theatrical, um, screenplay screen, silver screen version of the color purple and have been holding on to that hurt, the anguish and the heaviness of that movie that when we are presented with. Something that is just a shade lighter and a little bit joyful.

It's almost as if we were addicted to the trauma to the point where we can't accept happiness and the lightness that is presented to us in this musical.

And, and I think again, back to the. To the, the, the, the, this, the idea that if you're not, if you don't have that kind of upbringing where you're not exposed to musicals and a lot of stage plays, musicals are, have a likeness to them.

Um, inherently. Right. So I think as a people, I think maybe we've been holding on to not just the imagery and the quotes that we have lived on from that movie to the present time. We hold on to that energy, that heaviness that that movie, um, has. And so we can't even let go and enjoy the color purple now.

Movie today because of that I And and that's weird. That's why you have people picking it apart and saying it's push is pushing uh, the a gay agenda because And it's like first

Jay Ray: we talk about this for a second? I do want to go here. I'm glad you went here. And Kimberly, yes, we actually did talk about, uh, Mr's Redemption, um, in a little, a little while ago, actually right around the time we were talking about Sierra. So Oh. Yeah. Yeah. You know, and the

DJ Sir Daniel: and gentlemen.

Jay Ray: right, you know, the fact we talked about that resolve, like, uh, one of the things that Kipper said to me, this is, this is from, from Kipper and it was perfect.

He was like, one of the things we got here that we didn't get the last time is we got resolution, you know what I'm saying? We got, and you, sir, Daniel, just hearkening back. And I just want to definitely put a exclamation point on what you said is that's why. Grace for people and giving them room to live and to grow is so important because listen, every people have the opportunity to change.

All the things that shaped Mr. Was an Awful Person and a really despicable character. And we got to see why he was despicable, baby, because Lou Gossett Jr. was acting, okay?

[00:42:02] The Legacy of 'The Color Purple' and 'Dreamgirls'
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Jay Ray: Lou Gossett came up on this stage and Lou Gossett was chewing. I'm like, Lou Gossett eating up the scene too! But we got to see Why Mr.

and how Mr. ended up and how his son was like, I'm not going to be him.

DJ Sir Daniel: you go. Okay.

Jay Ray: And that's so beautiful how these people, these people were breaking these curses. So I want to, I want to say that, but I, to your point about going back to the relationship of, uh, between Celie and Shug, I was grinning from ear to ear.

You could not. Stop me from grinning when, uh, Taraji and Fantasia were singing, What About Love? That was the most gorgeous, freeing experience of watching these two women who have this affection for one another express it. Openly and during cause Mr. Saw it express it openly. And during a time when society today will tell you that no, we wasn't doing that back in the day.

People ain't do that back then. They wasn't doing that. Y'all this book was written in 1982. The book was written in 1982. Right? So I think it's some BS. I think people are always moving the goalposts for what. Is acceptable and could not understand the men in Seeley's life were never going to see her the way Suge saw her.

'cause if they were going to, they would've done it already. Suge saw her,

DJ Sir Daniel: And I think, and that point should resonate with someone like Abusi

Jay Ray: right? Mm

DJ Sir Daniel: because out from what I hear in some of his conversations and his retaliations is that people don't give him any grace and give him opportunity to make mistakes and grow. And it's so funny. It's so meta that you can't understand that.

That you're being represented on that screen. You're actually being represented on that screen. You're actually Sealy,

Jay Ray: Ooh.

DJ Sir Daniel: You're actually Seelie and you want us to see, to be Shug and see the beauty in you and accept you for the beauty that you have and watch you grow and change, right? You're also mister,

Jay Ray: He's very much Mr.

DJ Sir Daniel: You're also mister.

We need to see you and and know that you deserve redemption But it's so funny that people can't can't actually are so Wow, they're so caught up in In the, muck of being themselves and being caught up in everything and the malaise of, of drugs and every, and excess and too much information that you can't disconnect for a minute and sit in a, in a student, in a theater.

And actually have enough empathy to, to see yourself, see your humanity or recognize the humanity that's in you in a character on the screen, because that's what movies are supposed to do. That's what characters do is they reflect back to us, parts of our humanities. If you ask any actor that's playing a villain.

They will tell you my job is not necessarily to play up the nastiness. My, my job as an actor is to find part of that humanity in that character and find out why they're acting this way. And so once I dig into that, then I can fully embody the character because that's all of us. We've all got a villain and we've all got heroes within us as well. So I think, you know, the chatter. Some people just like to say things just to be heard and feel like they don't exist if they're not part of the conversation.

[00:46:30] The Importance of Grace and Redemption in Storytelling
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And maybe this is their way to doing it. But for those of us that are emotionally intelligent, we get it, we get it. And what we can do is what this movie will teach us is that we can continue to extend grace to people. To an extent, we're not going to be, you know, we're not going to be stupid and keep them around, but we're going to extend grace to you from over here

Jay Ray: love, we'll love you. We'll love you from, we'll love you from over here. You stay over, you stay where you at, you over there. So, okay. So Sir Daniel, um, what is your favorite number from the color purple 2023

DJ Sir Daniel: I gotta say it was definitely, um, Shug's jute joint scene.

Jay Ray: baby was it pushed the button.

DJ Sir Daniel: Push the button. She pushed it. All right.

Jay Ray: Do you see the Paula Abdul moment when the lights went out is the cold hearted moment.

DJ Sir Daniel: yeah, yeah, yeah, again, the, the modernity of it all Fatima injecting her, her, her years, decades of working on music videos, that sensibility injected and it worked,

It still looked like a period, it still felt like a jute joint,

Jay Ray: Mm

DJ Sir Daniel: but it gave it, it was, it was Fosse, it was all of those influences all wrapped into it and it just made it amazing.

So yes, that was, that was definitely my. Favorite musical part of the movie. I also enjoyed, um, what else was it? I lost my train of thought there, but go ahead. But definitely my favorite was the, the juke joint scene.

Jay Ray: You know, I enjoyed the musical, all the music scenes in, in this film, but ooh, that God is trying to tell you something scene with David Allen Greer and Taraji. My goodness today.

DJ Sir Daniel: What a choice, right?

Jay Ray: Right. Cause you know, we have in our minds that 1985 performance and to

DJ Sir Daniel: gospel

Jay Ray: big gospel number and, and it's so funny when this moment was happening and as beautiful as it was, I was like, Ooh, I wonder if like a choir is going to be in the church, which wouldn't make sense for the story.

Right. And then to do it. In this beautifully done way. And then just have the moment of them hug at the end where it's like, once again, resolution of, it didn't have to be all of this. It is this my daddy and the daddy, this is my daughter.

DJ Sir Daniel: Excellent. Excellent choice. Excellent observation. The restraint of that scene. It's like, okay. Y'all really gave it another layer of like, okay, there's intimacy in this moment. And healing. It was everything. It was, that was dope. That was really dope. I appreciated that's how you do a remake

folks. That's where the creativity comes into play.

Jay Ray: My goodness.

DJ Sir Daniel: So I think we answered the question what we can learn from the color purple and all those things. And, you know, I just, again, I really want to encourage us, you know, in the Queue Points way of doing things, encourage that other aspect. of Black creativity to be continued in our communities and just be ready to see more musicals.

[00:50:23] The Future of Black Musicals
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DJ Sir Daniel: Be open

minded. Expose your Children.

Jay Ray: Yes, more musicals. I would love to see some hip hop musicals. I would love to see, you know, now that her was in the color purple, I would love to see what her would do. You know, with a musical of some kind, does she have something like that in her? Like we need folks to write these stories.

And Oh, one last plug, one plug before we go, because this woman is the writer of one of my favorite songs of all time. And she co wrote the music for the color purple. And that is Brenda Russell. Brenda Russell co wrote the music for The Color Purple. That's why this stuff is so wonderful, by the way. But Piano in the Dark, by Brenda Russell, is one of my favorite songs of all time.

And, give it a little bit,

DJ Sir Daniel: all, you all know a little bit of love when you hear it, when you hear, um, I don't want to be a player no more by big pun and all of that stuff. Brenda Russell is a huge deal.

Jay Ray: Yes.

DJ Sir Daniel: her up folks.

Jay Ray: Yup. So just wanted to give a plug for and show love for and give Brenda Russell her flowers. But definitely go see the color purple. Um, it's still of course in theaters I'm sure it'll be moving to streaming platforms soon It's worth it. Rewatch dream girls y'all like it is a fun watch It is still entertaining you watch it with your friends. It's it was so much fun watching it with sir, Daniel

DJ Sir Daniel: especially when you know all the dialogue and you, you know, and, and it doesn't hurt that, um, Anika Noni Rose has become a viral meme at this point for

Jay Ray: I love that she played with it too. That was fun.

DJ Sir Daniel: that was so funny. So all you got to do is dream y'all all you've got to do is dream.

[00:52:20] Conclusion: The Impact of Black Music History
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Jay Ray: So listen, y'all to connect and keep up with Queue Points, do right what you are doing right now. And that is listening or watching to the show. Make sure that you hit subscribe. Um, make sure you share the show with your friends. Um, definitely, uh, join our newsletter and become a Queue Points insider. You could get more, uh, from Queue Points, um, at our magazine, Queue Points magazine.

So magazine. Queue Points. com all of that is completely free. If you want to do something and like, Oh, I want to do a little bit more. Um, go and, uh. Go ahead to our store and you can shop Queue Points. We're going to have some new stuff. So hold on real quick though. Mark, you ain't seen the movie yet. We done spoiled, child, we done spoiled the color purple for Mark.

DJ Sir Daniel: Oh Lord, but still go see your

Jay Ray: Still go see it. It's good.

DJ Sir Daniel: Well, listen, Jay Ray, what do I always say in this life? You have a choice. You can either pick up the needle or you can let the record play. I'm DJ Sir Daniel.

Jay Ray: And my name is J Ray y'all.

DJ Sir Daniel: This has been Queue Points podcast, dropping the needle on Black music history for 2024. Let's get it. We'll see you on the next go round. Peace.

Jay Ray: Peace.

[00:53:33] Closing Theme
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theater

Dreamgirls and The Color Purple: Exploring Broadway, Black Music, Film and Culture