Got That Oil: The Secret Ingredient of Every Black Music Legend

Transcript

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Hook

Sir Daniel: Don't you, don't, you just kinda roll your eyes just a little bit, when a, when a artist finds God and they wanna switch things up?

Intro Theme

Intro & Episode Setup

Sir Daniel: Greetings and welcome to another episode of Queue Points podcast. I'm DJ Sir.

Daniel

Jay Ray: And my name is Jay Ray, sometimes known by my government as Johnnie Ray, Kornegay III. what's happening, folks?

Sir Daniel: Queue Points podcast is the podcast dropping the needle on black music history. But, and, um, you know, with everything that's, that's been going on recently, Jay Ray, I can imagine,

Jay Ray: We gotta get closer to the Lord or whoever it is that you do your thing to.

Sir Daniel: Exactly. But Jay Ray, okay, this is just between me and you. Don't,

Do Musicians Who Find God Make You Roll Your Eyes?

Sir Daniel: you kinda roll your eyes just a little bit Every time musician, know, switches it up and they find God and they're just like, so pious and, and, and holy, and now all of a sudden, everything, you know, everything that they did to get where they are is out the window. Don't you, don't, you just kinda roll your eyes just a little bit. And when a, when a artist finds God and they wanna switch things up.

Jay Ray: I, I, I, d- I do. I, I do. And that's so sad. It's cynical. And the reason why I roll my eyes a little bit is because, you know, we got a long, we a little long in the tooth, sir Daniel, we done seen things happen and people do this, and by now we can recognize when it is real

Sir Daniel: Mm-hmm.

Jay Ray: it is some foolishness. Because there's some folks that I think we'll talk about tonight, where you're like, no, that's like an honest thing.

Right.

Sir Daniel: Right,

Jay Ray: but some of them folks, you'll be just like, for real though.

Sir Daniel: Yeah. And y- you're absolutely right. And you know, when I think about like our, our icons, the

The Church Roots of Black Music Icons

Sir Daniel: people that put in the work, years and years ago, a lot of them had, you know, had led very church-centered lives

Jay Ray: Yes.

Sir Daniel: at that time we're talking about Jim Crow

Jay Ray: Hmm?

Sir Daniel: a little post-Jim Crow era, being church-centered and. Having that was probably one of the only things that black people had to cling onto was the religion that was given to them.

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm.

Sir Daniel: And they, and, and they had to make their lives centered around that because that was a place of peace. It was a place of joy. It was a place to break out your, f- your Sunday's freshest, your Sunday best. So I get it.

I

Jay Ray: Queue

Sir Daniel: why a lot of our people, like, you know, Aretha Franklin,

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm.

Sir Daniel: um, loads of people

Jay Ray: Yeah

Sir Daniel: out and, but they were, came from a very church-centered life.

Jay Ray: Yes. I I mean, first of all, and we've talked about this on the show many times, right?

Sir Daniel: Mm-hmm.

Jay Ray: that we love has some sort of spiritual center. That's what make, that's the sauce. You know what I mean? So if people wanna know what the sauce is, part of the sauce is some kind of spiritual center where you understand that gift that you've been given, right?

Sir Daniel: Mm-hmm

Jay Ray: honed that gift probably in some sort of space that was spiritually led, led at one point, and now you give it to the world, it makes perfect, perfect sense, right? The stuff that we love. Got some of that. Got some of that. Good, good. Got some good, good from God in it.

Sir Daniel: Or as I like to say, they,

"Got That Oil" Spiritual Anointing in Music

Sir Daniel: it got that oil on it,

Jay Ray: It got that oil on it.

Sir Daniel: that

oil on it, And we can tell when y'all don't have that oil. There's a lot of young people today, they ain't got no oil.

Jay Ray: Right.

Sir Daniel: got no oil on they, the singing, their rapping. It's just dry and as ashy as can be.

Why Do Gospel Artists Cross Over to the Secular World?

Sir Daniel: Jay Ray, what makes you think causes an artist to come from that background? What do you think makes them dip their toe into the secular world and wanna take that chance?

Jay Ray: Ooh, because, ooh, because we are complicated be- not, Let me say that differently. We are multifaceted beings. Right.

Sir Daniel: Right.

Jay Ray: and because we are multifaceted be- beings and we, um. Uh, are, are connected to the world, and we're experiencing the world, right? There's a natural tendency to be like, okay, well, how can I take this a step further?

When I interviewed, um, Archbishop Carl Bean,

um, and we were talking about, uh, I was born this way, but he was like, before that, his first album, he said, no, I wanted to get out of the gospel box because I ha- I wanted to take this message to other people, right? And I knew that if I stayed in this gospel box, there's only so far it could go.

And I knew that the message could go further. So I think that's the big thing. I think, um, you know, people, folks wanna take the message out and, and they're having experiences and da, da, da. What about you?

Sir Daniel: I, I believe I get it too.

I get it. Because c- again, considering you're coming, we're coming out of, this is post Jim Crow era.

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm.

Sir Daniel: we've got a Vietnam War

in the l- uh, in the, f- in the, uh, forecast or even after that. There's a lot of things where, you know, black people are. Struggling to create identity uh, and to, to, to, to stake their claim in the world. And sometimes that takes stepping out of the box that takes leaving the church, which is a very secure, loving and warm place. But like you said, Carl Bean felt like he needed to go out and, um, take the message to other people.

But I, what I will say also is, is that a lot of those people outside of the black church, outside of the black community always found their way. To come to the church. I just automatically, while you were talking, I was thinking about Aretha Franklin's, um,

"Amazing Grace

Jay Ray: Yeah,

Sir Daniel: how Mick Jagger showed up to the recording

Jay Ray: he was listening.

Sir Daniel: how a lot of those other rockers showed up and they were sitting and, they were just sitting and eating it up.

Just eating the ho- the, the anointing up and just having a good old time. And then, then when you see the live stage shows, they're doing a variation of, you know, catching the Holy Ghost on stage and raking in millions and garnering lots of fans through that. So.

Jay Ray: You know, that is so interesting that you bring that up because I, I think there's a natural. Symbiosis. I, I don't even know if that's the right word, child, but there's this natural tendency, I think, for creatives to, uh, uh, uh, pull, uh, from inspiration from each other. Right? And like if you, g- if I get moved by something, I want to, uh, uh, recreate that creatively.

And so I think it's this natural tendency for folks to just kind of latch on to, uh, things that they see are creative. But I wanna go a, a step deeper too, um, about this particular part of the topic.

'cause it also makes me think of like, artists, how, how, um. How frowned upon if you were in gospel? How frowned upon it was if you chose to dip your toe on the secular side of things.

Um, and if we, you know, I talk about the girl can't dance a lot, so if y'all look up black music Mixtape, you can hear about the Girl Can't Dance, which is kinda like pre-punk, but it's Bunker Hill who was really David Walker, who was singing in the Mighty Clouds of Joy, but he had to take on this name because he would have been absolutely instantly.

And this man meanwhile is creating legendary music as a go, as part of a gospel group, and also creating legendary music as a rock act where it's like two songs exist in that moniker. So I just think it's a natural tendency for, to, for folks to just kind of like, okay, well soak it up, soak it up, and then put it out.

Transition

​

Sir Daniel: But, you know, what, Jay Ray, we've been, t- we've been talking about, um, the church and we

know that

Faith Beyond Christianity ... Islam, Hebrew Israelites & More

Sir Daniel: people automatically think Christianity.

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm

Sir Daniel: But Christianity is, is by far not the only religion where we see people, um, who have been in the, who are in the music industry. Marvin grew up in a religion called the House of God?

Jay Ray: I did not know that.

Sir Daniel: And They were very strict.

Jay Ray: Uh, that I knew.

Sir Daniel: now, and which his father of course was a part of,

Jay Ray: Yes.

Sir Daniel: that. And I didn't know there might've been, he was probably also a, um, a Hebrew Israelite Israelite also,

Which,

Jay Ray: Wow.

Huh

Sir Daniel: that, that, that says a lot. But, um, so yes, we got Christianity, but plenty of, you know, a lot of rappers

lean

into Islam and,

Jay Ray: Absolutely

Sir Daniel: and, know, they make, uh, we see a lot of people, a lot of artists, when they experience something life-changing,

So a lot of people experience, you know, really hard times. Some of them get close to death,

um, really bad, um, drug habits.

And so that's where they, they find themselves looking for a greater power to help them.

And we've seen plenty of examples of that. And

Artists Who Found God Through Crisis

Sir Daniel: one that sticks out to me the most, of course, is one of my favorites. Our favorites, of course, vanity,

Jay Ray: yes.

Sir Daniel: known as Denise Ma, Denise Matthews.

Who Mama made a complete change from here out to he-

Jay Ray: Yep.

Sir Daniel: TNA.

and

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm.

Sir Daniel: then she mama went and put on that good turtleneck,

pulled that hair back and put on those, those,

um, thick framed glasses and ha- and had her word in her hand, her good bible in her hand, and was ready to have, pr- was ready to have Bible study with you at the drop of a dime.

Jay Ray: absolutely. Um, what's interesting about Denise in particular, because I, she's one of those artists, she got that religion, honest, right? She talked about how she, how she got to God and saw that as, you know, her, God saving her right from the life that she was living. And I really respect that. You know what I'm saying?

Like there are, listen, one of the things that we know for sure, sir Daniel, is that the music industry. Tests a ton of people, you know what I mean? It's difficult. You gotta deal with all of this sheisty stuff and all of this, this, this difficulty, and everybody needs something to hold onto. Right. And I think when I, when I think about Denise specifically, I think of someone who was living, l- she was burning that candle on all the ends possible.

You know what I'm saying? And so her finding religion was, it didn't seem, it wasn't fake, you know, it was like, this is who I am now.

Sir Daniel: Right, because pla- you know, and when you think about it, what anybody that turns to religion or some sort, you know, the source, what they're looking for is a grounding.

they're looking for is some place to get themselves centered.

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm.

Sir Daniel: a lot of people feel like that is found in organized religion. And I'm not knocking it. Sometimes it, like you said, in her case it was needed

Sir Daniel's Story Growing Up Seventh Day Adventist

Sir Daniel: I grew up Seventh-day Adventist,

Jay Ray: Aha

Sir Daniel: so I know that sometimes the stricter. The, um,

Jay Ray: The

more you break out

Sir Daniel: the more you break out just a little bit, like, baby, you could, I could not wait get home to watch video Music Box. I remember, you know, as a Seventh-day Adventist, when the sun goes down on Friday, goes off. No

Jay Ray: right?

Sir Daniel: no nothing. And of course, in New York in the '80s on Friday night, we didn't have MTV, but what did we have? We had hot tracks with Ricky Velez and the rest of the crew, you know, and, and I wanted to watch that so bad so I could see what the latest videos were and watch the, the people popping, popping and locking and doing the latest dances. And, you know, I think that's a through line. It's like whatever. When you try to keep people away from things or keep them back from stuff, they tend to gravitate and want it even more when they can't have it.

Jay Ray: Yeah. Now this brings up a question, sir Daniel, 'cause Yes, that is very true. And I'm actually curious, I've never asked you this before.

Sir Daniel: Yes.

Jay Ray: when you reflect now, 'cause I'm sure when you were a kid

Sir Daniel: Mm-hmm.

Jay Ray: you have feelings about the experience that you're having, right?

Sir Daniel: Mm-hmm.

Jay Ray: So I'm curious to know, what do you remember feeling as a kid when you like, this is what I gotta do, and now when you reflect, what is it like now when you think about it?

Sir Daniel: When, when I was a kid, I felt, oh my God, this is so oppressive. is so boring. Every, all, everybody else is having a good time. And, you know, I just c- did not understand what is the, what is the big deal about, you know, wanting to hear a little rap music. Jay Ray, I will never forget, one day at school we had an assembly and it was I guess it was a week of prayer, I think they were calling it. And they had this youth pastor come by to the school and I didn't know what was going on. I think I was in the eighth grade.

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm.

Sir Daniel: I didn't know what was going on at first, but he had asked people to bring in their music, rap music,

hip, um, R&B, whatever, and they were going to do a music burning.

Jay Ray: No, not a burning.

Sir Daniel: you.

A- And there was like people were bringing out, like somebody walked up there with a copy of audio two's top billing and it took everything from me not to rescue

Jay Ray: No.

Sir Daniel: that vinyl copy of top billing. I was like, no.

I was like I don't know.

and I grew up in the era of the, do you remember the era of backwards masking? You know that term Jay Ray?

Jay Ray: Oh, you mean the playing it backwards?

Sir Daniel: when you play, it bask- backwards.

Jay Ray: Yeah.

Sir Daniel: of people, you know, messages from the devil and

all

this other stuff. Now granted there are some, uh, um, instances on that particular record where things are said in reverse

Jay Ray: I mean,

Sir Daniel: and it's.

Jay Ray: it's language. It happens

Sir Daniel: but

it's not,

Jay Ray: right?

Sir Daniel: but it's not, but it's not straight from, you know, it's not a memo from Lucifer or nothing like that. But, um, I, you know, that's, that was the kind of thing I grew up around.

And I just remember I just remember a moment, like when I was 13, where I just was like, broke away from all of that

and just was like, music, this th- there just can't be something bad about this music. It just makes me feel too so good. I don't wanna do bad things,

but I

do wanna have, I want to have a good time.

I like to, I like dancing. I like

all of

these things are good. These, you know, these people are good. What could, what possibly could come bad could come out of this? So that was my experience, And but then, and now as an adult,

so almost 50. um, what I, what I appreciate was the structure.

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm.

Sir Daniel: the structure of, you know, being a church kid, going, being Seventh-Day Adventist and being able to just, you know, just be a good person and have some structure to my life.

Be respectful of

Jay Ray: Yes.

Sir Daniel: good stuff that carries you, you know, can carry you throughout your life. But yeah, that was my experience.

​

Transition

Jay Ray: You may know this story, but

Jay Ray's Story A Catholic Kid's Spiritual Awakening

Jay Ray: my getting closer to God, um, actually took me out of the specifics of the book. 'cause I was reading the book for folks that don't know, I, when I was in middle school, I was kind of on a, uh, priest trajectory.

I was ba-baptized Catholic, the only one in my immediate family. 'cause I chose to do it because, you know, I be doing my own thing and my parents said, sure, this is a thing that we will allow. Right. So anyway, I remember very specifically having this very difficult spiritual experience involving, 'cause there was a party, we graduated from eighth grade, it was a whole thing and there was gonna be a party and blah, blah, blah.

And I didn't know if I could go. I was like, oh my God, no. there's gonna be like sinning at the party.

Sir Daniel: Mm-hmm.

Jay Ray: I, s- I promise you God was like, "Mm-mm, Go. Literally was like,

Sir Daniel: believe it

Jay Ray: go. I had the best time. And it literally changed my relationship to source.

Sir Daniel: Hmm

Jay Ray: I really understood, um, the power and I, dan- and my connection to dancing.

My connection to all of that was really pivotal. And so music, uh, uh, really was kinda my gateway to like really true spiritual grounding. Um, and so that's why, that's why I relate. Like I said, I get when there are artists that kinda go in that direction. But I think the other side of it though, sir Daniel, right,

Sir Daniel: Talk

Jay Ray: is,

Sir Daniel: it

Jay Ray: you can tell when the folks are doing it for the check, and there are people in our lives that do it for the check too.

Like there are people that I've seen that you're just like, now I know you.

It ain't, I know you,

Sir Daniel: Uh.

Jay Ray: this ain't what that is.

Sir Daniel: a- First of all, I'm, I'm still getting over the fact that in another life we could've been calling you Father Kornegay.

Jay Ray: could, you could absolutely have

Sir Daniel: could've been calling you Father Kornegay. but Yes, you're absolutely right. When I think of, that era that we were growing up, especially in like the, the sev- late '70s, early '80s,

The Prosperity Gospel & Hip Hop From Reverend Ike to Mase

Sir Daniel: we grew up in the Reverend Ike era

Jay Ray: Yeah.

Sir Daniel: there, w- and we saw, we saw the beginnings of the, um, do they call them?

The, the, um, that type of religion, The prosperity,

the prosperity movement, right?

Where they were preaching, everything was about prosperity. And you know, y- you need to attract, God wants you to be rich, blah, blah, blah. And so I think whenever we see rappers, R&B artists gravitate to that,

it makes sense because I think it's a continuum Of Of the lives that we've led, we've

Jay Ray: Yeah,

Sir Daniel: rap artists.

Jay Ray: yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Sir Daniel: Prosperity is, prosperity is the message in a lot of early hip hop. and getting rich, get money. You know, a lot of our favorite anthems are about prosperity and

getting rich. And so when you have, you know, church leaders, I'm not gonna name names, we know who they are. Start hanging out with your favorite rappers and, and your favorite rapper, starts hanging out with them and, you know, flying in their private, uh, helicopters and all of that.

Jay Ray: I have questions.

Sir Daniel: surprised in the least when all of a sudden one of your favorite rappers, Mase, opens up a church d- down the road, down to the Cheshire Bridge Road and has a congregation of young people following him because he's Mase

Jay Ray: I I can't, I was, I was about to defend it and I can't even defend it. Um, I will say this, you know, in all fairness, I, I side, I definitely side-eye, uh, pastor Mason or Reverend Mason. I don't know what moniker he used, but I side-eyed it. I'm also really sympathetic to the fact that folks. Do wanna get, uh, close to something spir- something, uh,

uh,

Sir Daniel: Higher?

Jay Ray: than themselves.

Something higher, something bigger than themselves. And if this rapper is going to be kind of your gateway to, to, to that exploration, I'm sympathetic to that. But I do think that same thing is w- what leads people, I think it, I think they be playing with the, I think they be playing y'all.

Sir Daniel: I like, I,

I'm not gonna act like I didn't side-eye Reverend Run when he was running around in, in fedoras and capes

Jay Ray: Right. With the collar on and I'm like,

"Ah, yeah. Yeah. Okay.

Sir Daniel: know, it, it seems just a, just a little performative, but there are, there are lots of, um, there are quite a few really old, really, um, older pioneers

that are, um, that are, uh, ordained ministers now.

Old School Rappers Turned Ministers From Kurtis Blow & Beyond

Sir Daniel: Like Kurtis Blow is an ordained minister, Um, Sparky d

who we've recently seen, and I'm so

Jay Ray: Yeah.

Sir Daniel: story got told.

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm.

Sir Daniel: Um, is an ordained minister You also, I believe Debbie d There's a lot of people from that era specifically, but then, but also they came up in a specific era, Reaganomics, the crack era.

They lived through that. They didn't necessarily get the, the, riches from hip-hop, which they helped create.

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm.

Sir Daniel: so. Moving on. I, it kinda, it makes sense that they would kind of grasp onto that. Not saying that what they're doing is a money grab, but a lot of them really pulled themselves out of like, all, tho- a lot of those people pulled themselves out, specifically out of a lot of addiction as well.

And so again, needing that higher power to, to help ground them and to pull them out of that and thinking, you know, a lot of people still believe that there is something that you have to, there's something on the other side

Jay Ray: Hmm.

Sir Daniel: that you have to be prepared for.

and that there's a place where it's supposed to be is, is hot and there's another place where there's pearly, you know, pearly gates and streets of gold. And you know, a lot of people wanna prepare themselves and like Mary Mary said, I wanna go. To heaven. You know, the So I, I get it. I

get

it

Jay Ray: Yeah.

Sir Daniel: if you come from the, there's an era of people, there's an era where people grew up and that was really preached and driven into our psyches. And if you survived Reaganomics, if you survived the

'80s, you had a crack addiction or whatever, and you came out of that, I kinda see why you're like, Ooh, you

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm

Sir Daniel: the Lord pulled me out of that.

So I'm turn, I'm giving my life over to him and living on the, on the righteous path because I was saved from certain death.

Jay Ray: You know, and I think, I think there is, um, there's value in that, right? There's value in this experience. And I think this actually leads to right what Jeremy Avalon is saying in the chat. So Jeremy Avalon lifted up the name of Project Pat. I didn't know Project Pat had had this experience, but Jeremy Yeah, so Jeremy is, uh, saying when they were on the road for art beats and lyrics, project, pat would let the crowd rap, rap all of his dirty lyrics.

So Project Pat wasn't doing it. He let the crowd do it and then he would pass out Christian books after the show. That is a very like, creative way to handle this situation and it's able to hold. Both things. Jeremy, I don't know if, uh, he, he, he spoke about or if you had a chance to talk to him about this, but I actually respect that approach to doing it.

It's not saying he's not dissing his, his it, what got him to that stage. You know what I mean? 'Cause we do experience that. Where we saw this in the little Richard documentary, I Am Everything where it was like when Little Richard was on his, his like religion side of things. It was like all things in that former world or that other world he could not be part of at all.

Sir Daniel: He had to make a clean break

Jay Ray: Clean break. Yeah,

Sir Daniel: the tutti and the fruity. He had to make a clean break from it all. That reminds me also, I think of salt from Salt-N-Pepa.

Jay Ray: absolutely.

Sir Daniel: know, when she, I will say this now, there was a, she was working on a, a, an album, a solo album that I believe was heavily influenced by gospel.

And I

Jay Ray: Was salt of the, was it salt of the earth or something?

Sir Daniel: to that effect,

Jay Ray: Yeah

Sir Daniel: think she might've, I think that might've snapped because is a very capable rapper.

She's a

very capable rapper, dope producer, all of that good stuff. So I think that might've snapped and we got to see what she could do on Kirk Franklin's stomp, which is to this day is still, uh uh,

Jay Ray: Changed everything.

Sir Daniel: Z loves that 30 year that 30-plus-year-old record.

They love it.

Jay Ray: It changed the trajectory of Kirk Franklin's career, like that song, and so many, and he's of course talked about this now, about how. Like once again that, that, that gospel world was like, what in the world? No, but let me tell you, it's now opened up a world where we get all of these other, you know, artists that have come out of it. so I, What I love about this conversation, sir Daniel, is um, it's so easy in our current moment to be cynical about everything.

And I think what we're asking people to be is, um, it's not every, everything is not the same. You know what I mean? And it's up to us to be able to discern. I've, I think I've mentioned, um, uh, oh, and my brother just went to see her, uh, uh, Cleo from the uk, her name is Escap. The last name is escaping me, but somebody's gonna do it in the chat.

Cleo Sol. M-

Sir Daniel: Mm-hmm

Jay Ray: Cleo Sol's, the, her approach to this music and infusing it with this spirituality is, is so

uplifting. You know what I mean? And.

Sir Daniel: other people say the same thing.

Jay Ray: yeah, so I think more, I think more artists need to, whatever that oil is, you need to go get that oil so you can put it in your music.

Sir Daniel: Speaking of which I have, I know I mentioned Salt probably would've had a dope album, but I'ma be honest,

Is Gospel Rap Any Good?

Sir Daniel: I have never heard a gospel rap or rapper that I liked. just something about, it's just never stu- Remember DC talk

Jay Ray: I do remember DC talk. I

do.

Sir Daniel: stuff, I, uh, I would listen and I'm just like, it's not grabbing me.

I don't know what it was about gospel rappers that just never did it for me. It just never, never grabbed me. But it's funny that we mention Kirk Franklin

who is as controversially conver- controversial as he is. In the eyes of the church. I think he is the most capable and the best example of how you can operate in your gift and minister to people and still entertain and

still have a good time. And I, when r- really when he's being criticized, I'm like, I really don't get it. I don't get So what he got on tight pants. I mean, it got y'all to the, it got y'all there to, um, to salvation. If it took him in some

Jay Ray: if it took them tight pants to get you to South

Sir Daniel: Come on now.

Jay Ray: you

better preach.

Sir Daniel: Here's the moment.

Jay Ray: I, I will say, um, one, I had to think about it, but one gospel rapper that I, I think was really dope chance the rapper always landed for me.

Sir Daniel: So, so he's, con- he

Jay Ray: I could, I put,

Sir Daniel: rapper.

Jay Ray: I mean, I put him in the gospel rap. Category because I

mean, he, he, was very spiritually centered and he was not afraid to talk about God in his music.

And he was very open about, you know, his, his, his religion. So I, I think I would've put chance kinda in there. And probably the only one like that I would really say is like dope. If there are some, if there are some gospel rappers out there, y'all in the chat that are dope, let us know. Queue Point, We will listen.

We will even invite you into the room and we'll listen together.

Sir Daniel: Change our minds

Cha-

Jay Ray: our mind.

Sir Daniel: our minds. If there, there's a, and I know people are gonna say, I know the name Lecrae is gonna come up.

Jay Ray: oh yeah.

Sir Daniel: that's a

Jay Ray: I forgot about that

Sir Daniel: that I've heard quite a bit of. Still never, still haven't really experienced his music. But, um, yeah, like Jay Ray said, change our minds, you know, us to it.

Yes, 'We all have a path to go down and I think it's really, it's all about being genuine and I think that's the difference between everybody that we've spoken about in this episode is that. You can clearly tell what they were going through or what they were experiencing was either real for them and was a real thing, or was just another, um, another money grab

another w- another hustle and look. So there were some people that we just never got a full, we never got like an album.

Whitney, Fantasia & Avery Sunshine ... Artists With That Oil

Transition

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Sir Daniel: but I think we can't, can't wrap up this discussion without bringing Whitney into this.

Jay Ray: Ooh, that girl. Ooh. You wanna talk about an anointing?

Sir Daniel: We can't,

Jay Ray: Hmm.

Sir Daniel: We cannot have this discussion without mentioning Whitney Elizabeth Houston because there is, W- when you talk about oil, that's people, that's who we talking about. I get that same feeling when I hear Fantasia.

Jay Ray: Mm. Oh my God. Yes.

Sir Daniel: and most recently, Avery Sunshine.

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm. Yes.

Sir Daniel: So there

I--

Jay Ray: fun. Fun.

Av-

Sir Daniel: from Avery, from your

Jay Ray: Ye-

Sir Daniel: from Chester.

Jay Ray: from Chester. Mm-hmm.

Sir Daniel: So there are people in those instances, I realize, I respect, I respect that oil

when I hear those people sing and open up their mouths.

Closing Thoughts

Jay Ray: Yes. Who y'all got? Let us know in the chat who are some folks, especially some contemporary artists that you like. Mm, yes. They got that, that that's exactly what you need. It's flowing through them. Let definitely let us know. Um, but of course we have more thank y'all for tuning in for this, uh, part of the conversation, um, where we talk about just kinda the pivot to the pulpit.

thank you. Subscribe wherever you are. If they have a notification bell, hit that so that you can get notified when there are new episodes of Queue points. Uh, Visit our website at queuepoints.com. You can, uh, watch all of our old episodes.

And if you really wanna support us as well, keep the lights on in Queue points land. We would appreciate it. You can visit our store at store.queuepoints.com. We appreciate y'all. We love y'all.

Sir Daniel: Like I always say in this life, you have a choice. You can either pick up the needle or you can let the record play. I'm DJ Sir Daniel,

Jay Ray: And my name is Jay Ray.

y'all

Sir Daniel: and this is Queue Points podcast, dropping the needle on black music history. We will see you on the next go-round. Peace.

Jay Ray: Peace y'all.

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