Chaka Khan's Rock Era: 1986, Bowie, Palmer, and Winwood

Transcript

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[00:00:00] Intro Theme

[00:00:16] Welcome to the Show

Sir Daniel: Greetings and welcome to another episode of Queue Points podcast, a very special

Jay Ray: Hey

Sir Daniel: of Queue Points podcast. I am DJ Sir Daniel

Jay Ray: And my name is Jay Ray, sometimes known by my government as Johnnie Ray Kornegay III. What's happening, y'all? We have to absolutely show love to this woman, who is a marvel of nature. Chaka Khan is having a wonderful week, and we needed to just have this conversation about this woman in this very Queue Points kind of way, which we'll talk about in a minute.

But this is what this is all about, man. This is all about that

[00:01:01] Chaka Khan as Fire — Voice as an Instrument

Sir Daniel: Dear Yvette Marie Stevens, what can I say? I mean, Jay Ray, Chaka Khan is literally the embodiment of her chosen name or the ch- the name bestowed upon her. When you think of fire, fire is b- at s- at, at one time beautiful and, uh, f- destructive and strikes fear in the hearts of people, but it also brings warmth.

She embodies all of those things. She is the physical embodiment of all of those things. And Jay Ray, that voice, I mean, we're gonna get into the things, but the voice is truly why we are here to discuss her because it is, it has been called an instrument, and it literally, it is an instrument that unto itself has, throughout the decades, has ushered in various waves of, of, uh, of movements that she's been a part of.

She's not one that could be boxed into any to one genre. Chaka Khan is just plays Tic-Tac-Toe and hopscotch on, on all these girls, like when it comes to different genres and using her, her natural born voice. I mean, yeah, she could play the drums. You know, she, she can do all things. I'm pretty certain she plays other instruments.

But it's that voi- that voice. That voice is the, is, is the thing. It's the it thing. And I mean, let's just take "Through the Fire," for instance

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm.

Sir Daniel: You know, "Through the Fire," um, "To the Limit," "Come What May." It's just one of those... That's one of those songs that I understand why Kanye fought so hard

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm.

Sir Daniel: to clear that sample.

And I also find it interesting that Chaka does not like to hear her name repeated a lot. She doesn't like to hear her name repeated, which is why she hates-- She's not a big fan of, um, her cover of Prince's, um, "

Jay Ray: I Feel for "

Sir Daniel: I Feel for You." So Chaka is just a, she's an interesting, she's an interesting character, you know, can be prickly at times, but she's als- but she's also this, you know, welcoming earth goddess that, you know, wants to, to, to wrap her voice around you and encompass you in song.

But, I mean, that's the life of a artist. The, a lot of artists that are truly embodied and encompass a gift that is outside of themselves, that has nothing to do with them, that's truly God-given,

Jay Ray: Yeah

Sir Daniel: will tell you that they're not in control of that, that it's, it's truly outside of them, and they have to, and they have to, um, surrender to it when it's time to surrender to it, and not necessarily...

And they sometimes just don't necessarily want to deal with the other things that come along with stardom and celebrity, as we saw recently during Prince's birthday with that interaction she had with, um, paparazzi.

Jay Ray: so weird, yeah

Sir Daniel: which is so weird, but, I mean, listen,

[00:04:21] 45 Years of What'cha Gonna Do For Me

Sir Daniel: we're celebrating 45 years of "What'cha Gonna Do!"

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm.

Sir Daniel: And let's, let's just talk about Mother Chaka

Jay Ray: yeah, so, um, 45 years ago, uh, Chaka Khan's third solo album comes out, What You're Gonna Do for Me. Here's what's interesting about this. Um- Chaka 1973 takes over as the lead singer of Rufus for Paulette McWilliams, who is an entity unto herself, right? And Chaka Khan, uh, takes over as the lead singer of the group.

They release their debut album called Rufus. It's just called Rufus. By album two, it is Rufus featuring Chaka Khan. Because what's interesting, and if you go back and you listen to Rufus, you definitely hear the beginnings of what we have today, but it is definitely different. But there's something really interesting about that record. It sets up at the beginning that Chaka Khan is not just an R&B singer. She's not just a funk singer. She is playing, they are playing with rock, they are playing with folk, and she is doing all of those things equally in in good measure. So when we talk about the voice, one of the things that is unique about Chaka's voice is, uh, M- Miles Davis, uh, helped her understand that no, your voice is like a horn. And so when you contextualize, when you hear that and you listen to Chaka, you're like, "Oh, I really understand this now." Because even as she, in every single song you listen to, she's dancing around the song as a horn would dance around these songs, but with her vocals. So she's sometimes low. She's sometime squealing high. All of these things a trumpet would do, right? And What You're Gonna Do for Me is, like I said, album number three. She is still in Rufus, but Rufus has now already done two albums that don't feature Chaka that haven't performed well on the charts. Chaka has entered her solo era, and this album is unique because it combines jazz, it's heavily jazz influenced, and of course it's giving you like R&B, and Chaka is doing a little bit of smooth and a little bit of hard.

So, uh, three of the songs on this record that folks will know. One, they're gonna know the title track, What You're Gonna Do for Me. They're going to know And the Melo- the Melody Lingers On, which pulls from Night in Tunisia, D- Dizzy Gillespie tune. And for dancers,

I Know You, I Live You is not a song that you can't...

If you go to any party where there is Black folks dancing,

Chaka Khan's I Know You, I Live You is coming on at some point.

Sir Daniel: And you are absolutely not supposed to cut it off before the breakdown.

Jay Ray: the breakdown

Sir Daniel: You, if you, let me just tell you just straight up now, uh, if you happen to be a DJ watching this, if you, and you're learning, if you ever get a chance to play "I Know You, I Live You," especially if it's a group of people of a certain age, do yourself a favor, do not cut the song

Jay Ray: play it out. Just play that

song

Sir Daniel: it out. I know it's, I know it's long. It's, it's long, especially in today's standards. But it is a, it is true, it's a, it's a word from God, and you don't cut that off.

Jay Ray: No.

You don't cut

Sir Daniel: cut that off. The, your bless- your blessing, your breakthrough is on the other side of that bridge.

Jay Ray: A- baby, you

better tell him

Sir Daniel: to get that. You need to, you need to stay there and let the people get that.

And you, and you, DJ, will be blessed by that as well. Take it from me. Mark my words on that one

[00:09:20] What'cha Gonna Do For Me — The Ned Doheny Story

Jay Ray: So to this point, right, uh, we've already mentioned the title track, What You're Gonna Do For Me, and this really sets up the conversation that Sir Daniel and I wanted to have tonight. So, um, Chaka Khan has, uh, a very wide-ranging, um, recording career. Um, once again, since the beginning. She hears a song, um, written by, uh, uh, Ned Doheny and Hamish Stuart.

Hamish Stuart, uh, was with the Average White Band. Ned Doheny had b- uh, is a songwriter that had released many, many records up until that point. But, you know, these are both, uh, white men that play in soft rock and yacht rock spaces. Chaka hears What You're Gonna D- the Ned Doheny, uh, uh, demo of What You're Gonna Do For Me, and is like, "I want that song. I want that song." And so they, they are like, "Yes, Chaka Khan can have this song," right?

Sir Daniel: Shaka can have what she

Jay Ray: Chaka can have what she wants, and we get this magical song that becomes the title track for this album from these two white men, rock, funk songwriters, uh, H- Hamish, uh, uh, Hamish, uh, Stuart and Ned, uh, Doheny. I, uh, reached out to Sir Daniel because what happened was I didn't know this demo existed. I was in the car with my brother, and What You're Gonna Do For Me starts playing, but it's a different version. I was like, "Is this, like, a remake of What You're Gonna Do For Me?" And he was like, "No, it's actually the demo." They didn't release it until 2014 because of, you know, the song had come out and become a hit for Chaka Khan, but the demo is great.

So if you ever get to hear the Ned Doheny, uh, uh, uh, demo for that song, it's amazing. Um, it's more of a soft rock demo, but it's great. But it got us to thinking about the fact that Chaka Khan is a r- a, a rock icon as well, and that's how we're contextualizing her tonight. So we wanted to spend some time talking to all of you all about these times in music history where Chaka Khan stepped squarely into, like, a rock space, bodied it, and was still able to do all these other things.

[00:12:01] Transition

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[00:12:08] VH1 Voted Chaka Khan #17 Greatest Woman In Rock

Sir Daniel: Jay Ray and I consumed a lot of VH1 shows back in the day. And if you're old enough to remember, VH1 was like, had pristine programming when it came to producing very educational, um, clip shows and list, and list shows of very important people throughout rock 'n' roll history.

Um, they've done R&B, hip-hop, you name it. There was a VH1 list show, a pop-up video show. And during get- and getting ready for this particular episode about Chaka, VH1 s- has Chaka listed squarely in the top 20 list of women of rock 'n' roll. As a matter of fact, when Susan Sarandon, you all know who she is, introduced her at number 17, her name means fire.

Like I said at the beginning, this is Chaka Khan. And I totally get it. I, like I said in the beginning, Chaka came of age. You could see it where, where the, uh, part of that hippie movement, part of that, that Woodstock crowd, um, the free love era, you know, uh, s- sex, drugs, and rock 'n' roll. At the b- very beginning of that era where there was a, a lot of free space, there was a lot of space for, um, the, for young people that were trying not to be like their parents, like that p- that previous generation, and intermingling with each other.

And where they most intermingled was in spaces, in concert spaces, music spaces, um, on the dance floor or on the stage performing in these bands. And so I can totally see Chaka, um, approaching a song like a, um, like a Janis Joplin,

Jay Ray: Yeah, yeah, yeah

Sir Daniel: who I'm sure she's been compared to a lot in her earlier years. And then if you look back on some of the videos, she presented very flower child, wild child, rock 'n' roll hippie.

The... She was doing the flower headdresses before y'all had that filter on your phone. So give it up for Chaka Khan and, you know, as a rock 'n' roll, as a rock 'n' roll icon

[00:14:36] 1986 — Chaka's Rock Star Year

Jay Ray: Absolutely, man. Like, so there is a moment in time, uh, the 1980s were an interesting period for a lot of Black women in music.

Um, we saw, and we've, we've talked about this, we saw in the early to mid-'80s, um, a significant pivot for a lot of Black women who were, of course, super famous in, in, in Black music spaces, but pop music spaces are being introduced to them in this unique way. Chaka is kind of an outlier in that she already was straddling all of these different worlds, so rock fans already kind of knew her. But there is a moment in time, so post, uh, I Feel for You in 1984, Chaka Khan is a huge star. So you got I Feel for You, you got This Is My Night, you got Through the Fire. Um, and Chaka is now like, wow, a, a, a bigger star, but she's not a f- a, a, a, a artist resting on her laurels.

So

in 1986 specifically, a bunch of unique things happen that literally situate Chaka Khan almost that entire year in rock space. So she releases, uh, the album Destiny, which is basically a pop rock album. Um, I went back in preparation for this show and was just kinda listening to that record and I'm like, "Oh, I forgot about this." You have Love of a Lifetime behind you, which was the lead single from that album. Um, and but in 1986, three other things happened First and foremost, Chaka doesn't appear on this song for a very specific reason. We'll talk about that in a minute. Chaka Khan is in conversation with Robert Palmer, who is about to blow up. Robert Palmer is literally about to blow up in 1986. His album Riptide is, is, is coming out. And was that '86 or '85? Somewhere around there. Anyway, point is, um, one of the things that we learned much later on with Addicted to Love by Robert Palmer is that Chaka Khan did the vocal arrangement for that song. But not only did she do the vocal arrangement for that song, she actually was supposed to duet on that song.

But her record label was like, "Nah, that's- that's not a thing. You're not gonna do that." And, um, it didn't happen, but Chaka really wanted it to happen. Um, and but we get But when you listen to the song back now, you be like, "I see how Chaka

arranged this song."

Like, you can literally hear her vibe in that song. Not only that, um, we do see Chaka this time, and BET played this video. Steve Winwood is coming out, um, Higher Love, and we hear Chaka wailing on the hook for that song with Steve Winwood, and that becomes a huge, a huge pop hit. But it was dope seeing Chaka Khan just kinda hanging out with Steve

Sir Daniel: Yeah, spinning around in black and white, you know, f- flowing in her best Stevie Nicks, um, shawl, you know.

Jay Ray: So Chaka also makes an appearance with David Bowie on the Labyrinth soundtrack in 1986, and she's singing, um, backgrounds there. So this entire year we have Chaka's album, which is basically a pop rock album. We have, uh, Steve Winwood, we have Robert Palmer cooking, we have David Bowie cooking, and all of these artists are There's the, the one common denominator with all of them is that Chaka Khan is somewhere in the mix, either vocally or arranging, making moves in these rock spaces, and it made, it helped these songs pop

Sir Daniel: Literally.

Jay Ray: Literally

[00:19:05] Reflecting on an Era of Black Women in Rock

Sir Daniel: And what I love about that era, you mentioned that Chaka was in the company of a, a lot of other Black women who were experiencing this main- this mainstream success, and they were all of a certain age, Jay Ray.

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm.

Sir Daniel: They... These weren't spring chickens. Like, they were firmly rooted in their gifts and just sprinkling magic all across the world.

I think the, the greatest, um, example of that, of course, is Tina Turner, who I think is, like, the blueprint for that kind of crossover rock 'n' roll, you know, high priestess i- uh, image and, um, of a Black woman in pop and mainstream just all-around, um, music. And Chaka is, like, right there next to her

Jay Ray: Yeah. Ooh, fun fact. I'm so glad you mentioned Tina Turner. So as a, as an aside but related, Chaka Khan, um, has stated matter of factly, she, she said it in an interview to Rolling Stone that the first record that she ever bought was Led Zeppelin II.

Sir Daniel: Hmm

Jay Ray: Here's the overlap. That album includes Whole Lotta Love, which we've talked about in the Tina Turner episode. Tina Turner's version of Led Zeppelin's Whole Lotta Love is probably the definitive version of that song. It came out on the Acid Queen album, and if y'all have never heard Tina Turner's version of Whole Lotta Love, it is crazy dope. Y'all need to go rock that. And that so happened to be the song that was included on the first album that Chaka Khan said, "First album I bought was Led Zeppelin II.

It played like a movie."

Sir Daniel: See? All interlocked, intertwined

[00:21:09] Quick Transition

[00:21:11] Chaka Khan Appears On 1970's Rock Songs

Jay Ray: one of the earliest, um, overlaps, so because Chaka was in Rufus, the, the, the brothers that was in Rufus were doing a whole bunch of things. Rufus was one of the best bands of the era. You've had people say that time and time again, like if there was a band to beat, it was Rufus. And, um, Chaka appears on Take Me Back to Chicago by Chicago, which was co-written by, um, Hank, uh, Wolinski o- of Rufus. So Chaka appears on that song. It's a dope song, so you should go back and hear it. Go back and listen. That's '78. Um, she does two songs with Ry Cooder on his 1979 album. She's on Down in Hollyhood and Don't Mess Up a Good Thing. She's on both of those joints from '79. So this is after her debut, so she's still doing rock stuff. Um, and so we talked about '86 as, like, this moment in time when Chaka was squarely in, like, no, she's in her, like, her rock era.

Sir Daniel: Mm-hmm

Jay Ray: But she was true to this. Like, this wasn't new to her. Like, she had already been performing on these songs in the 1970s. So, um, we just wanted to let folks know that this is part of her journey. So this woman has been doing, like you said early in the show, like tic-tac-toe with her career and moving around and doing all these different things, and rock happens to be a place where she's leaned in. Ooh, we didn't talk about this one thing. Um, her favorite duet that she's ever done with Peter Cetera, who was also part of Chicago. Peter Cetera had a song, uh, called Feels Like Heaven in 1992. Chaka Khan is on the record of saying that is her favorite duet that she's ever done. Beautiful song, pop rock song, Chaka Khan and Peter Cetera is her favorite joint

[00:23:19] The Peter Cetera Duet

Sir Daniel: What was Peter Cetera's like big song, crossover song?

Uh, Glory of Love

See, kids growing up, growing up in the '80s, I, I just can't... I know we talk a lot about it, and it seems like we are, we're romanticizing that era. But when you, I don't know, if you're affected by music the way Jay Ray and I were affected by music growing up, whenever you heard songs like that, regardless of who, what package they came in, they affected you de- deeply and differently than other people.

And they were programming songs, they were building these songs to be larger than life.

And Chaka Khan, as you all have heard from Jay Ray, is like, was just so skillful and adept at just pairing herself with different mediums and different people and just bringing out the be- not only did sh- she bring out the b- she, they brought out the best in her, she brought out the best in them

[00:24:25] The Voice as an Instrument — The Colors Performance

Jay Ray: Oh yeah, yeah. She's a, that, that, that voice, it truly is an instrument. Like when you- So bringing it to, to present day, when you watch The Colors performance that was recently released, I was watching and I'm like, "Oh, it's almost like her brain is churning, figuring out how, where do I wanna go next, and where, how am I gonna land this?"

Like, it's almost like, 'cause she can go so many places with the voice. It's like, okay. And then you watch her at the end in the refrain, like just kinda settle into, "I'ma just do whatever."

You know what I'm saying? I don't have to worry about being technical in this moment. But there are these times where I watched her, or I thought I was seeing in The Colors performance, like her br- her wheels turned to be like, "Okay, well how do I go from here to here?" Um, and that is a power of a vocal, um, of a, of a powerful instrument and a powerful musician, 'cause that's important. Um, but Sir Daniel, we can't leave this conversation without discussing this important moment, and I think this also just kinda sits, it tells you where her gift comes from, because anybody else could've been ruined by this. But it was like, but d- that didn't matter in the case of Chaka Khan, and we're talking about the 1987, uh, B.B. King & Friends performance, which a lot of people are familiar with

[00:26:16] The 1987 B.B. King & Friends Performance

Sir Daniel: You know, we... It goes without saying that a lot of musicians who are The only way I could describe some s- a lot of musicians, artists like that, is like they're, they're born an exposed nerve. They're super sensitive, and a lot of times in order to deal with that sensitivity, a lot of times they, you know, they give into indulgences.

They indulge in things to, to help numb certain things, to help quiet certain voices, certain noises. And, um, Chaka Khan, you know, has, like a lot of artists, has, has indulged in, you know, substances that were app- could make, was apparent during performances. And she's not the only one. You know, there's recordings of Billie Holiday.

You can hear her nodding, when she's nodding off, and the orchestra has to, is like, has to stop and start all over again in the middle of a recording because she's lost her place. You know, other... A- and other musicians have dealt with that. And in this particular performance, we saw visibly

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm.

Sir Daniel: that Chaka had...

Now mind you, she had t- two other performances in that show where she, you know, she was co- she was cooking,

Jay Ray: Yeah

Sir Daniel: you know, on all cylinders. But here's the, the miraculous thing, and this is why I, when I, when we talk about people and the oil, you

Jay Ray: People and the, and the oil

Sir Daniel: the oil. Chaka is clearly discombobulated, like her, um, her head hung over and, you know, in the midst of whatever she's going through physiologically.

But when it comes time for her to sing, 'cause she's standing next to Etta James and Gladys Knight,

who are, you know, who without a doubt are singing their faces off. And so for her in, in the, in the midst of that, whatever she was in the midst of, you know, it b- it was almost her time to sing and you could visibly see Etta James kinda nudge her like, "Hey, hey, you're up next."

And when it came time for her, it was like a switch went off and she just moved that hair out of her face and began to, to, to clown on the microphone like nobody's business and, and sing "Precious Lord"

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm.

Sir Daniel: like literally like her life depended on it. And that's when I talk about, when I say things about there are certain people who are...

Th- the gift is, is definitely outside of them. That gift is from the source. It is not of them, and sometimes that's why when people, you know, when she was on, she was on a I think "The Breakfast Club" and they wanted to bring up, you know, the, the, the, the perf- the versus performance and she's like, "I don't wanna talk about that."

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm.

Sir Daniel: Because she probably just was not there in that moment, you know? And, and, and a lot of people that are dealing with addiction and, and use sub- and use substances, a lot of times they don't even remember that. They're taken out of that completely, and then she has to perform at the same time.

So I don't know. I feel like we give her... She's been given a lot of s- grace in those instances, but that's only because she let the... She, she takes care of her gift and she let the gift be used in that moment. And yeah, I- it's just one of those things where it's like when you see that happening in real time,

Jay Ray: Mm-hmm.

Sir Daniel: you know that that is not of this world.

That's not her. That's something else taking over her in that moment

Jay Ray: Yeah. Oh, it's, it's so interesting that you talk about, uh, the taking care of the gift. Um, Malik Yusha on YouTube, and we'll make sure in the description we include the link to the video, um, actually recently just did a, a, a documentary for Chaka Khan background singers, including Sandra St. Victor was in that.

So y'all could go check that out. I haven't watched it yet. But he did a great video, um, this is a couple years ago now, on, like, the voice of Chaka Khan and kind of the breaking down of her voice as an instrument.

And one of the things that he said in the video, and I'm really paraphrasing because I have not seen it in at least two years, but he talked about the fact that what's unique about Chaka Khan is she had such a, a, a full command, or she has such a full command of her voice and her range, and her range is really wide. But because she has such full command of it, she's never gone outside of it, so her instrument has been preserved because of it. So whereas, you know, some artists, um, may strain, may go above, may move beyond what they can do, Chaka has mastered what her voice can do,

and stays and plays in that range, and that's what's And, and the, the point he was making was that's one of the things that's protected her ability to be able to do that same wail on Through the Fire that she did in 1985, to do that in 2026 because of the command of her instrument. She understands it, she knows where she can go, and what she does is she plays within it at the extremes.

So we feel like she's doing a lot. She's not. She's just doing what she has the ability to do

Sir Daniel: But Jay Ray, why can't-- why don't other people know to do that? Why, why do people, why do other performers run the risk of blowing out their gift, their instrument, and just, you know, trying to do things that they can't do anymore? Because y- you know, your, as you age, your voice changes, and then there are other things that we do as far as how we take care of our body will also affect that instrument.

But why doesn't, doesn't everybody know that? Don't the performers typically know that about taking care of their voices? Why aren't more people doing that?

Jay Ray: Well, it's interesting. I, I, you know what? I don't know the answer if there ... I wish Kipper Jones was here because he's a musician and can talk about this.

Um, in particular, a musician that uses his voice as part of his instrument. Um, I'ma go out on a limb and say it's because Chaka Khan early on, to Harold's point, figured out that she was not only just a singer, she was part of the band.

Sir Daniel: Mm-hmm. Uh,

Jay Ray: when you understand that your voice is an instrument that is also part of the band, you act like that. So you figure out what the limits of the instrument are, and then you play at the margins of that without going beyond. So it's, that's why I think it is. It's the connection to instruments and mu- other musicians.

That's because they see her as an instrument, and she sees herself that way. So I think that's what it is. A lot of singers just see themselves as singers. And Chaka Khan has always, and you can tell by the way the songs move, she always has m- used her voice as like, "No, I'm just a, I'm an extra pl- I'm an extra instrument in this song.

How do I make that, how do I do that?"

Sir Daniel: And the fact that I think that when you mentioned earlier that Miles Davis is the one that pointed out to her that fact that her voice is an instrument, imagine finding that out or being gifted with that gem, that nugget, that early in your life. Imagine if we were all somebody pointed out to you, "Hey, Jay Ray, this is, this is your gift, and this is what you need to do to take care of it."

And at, at a very early age. Imagine if somebody said that to me, how... Who knows where we could be right now? Who knows? Well, I mean, we're supposed to be right here, right now on Queue Points with you all, but just imagine. Imagine being that fortunate. But again, that's why I say all of this is, is pred- was prewritten and predetermined. When I bring that up again about the, the spiritual aspect of Chaka Khan, Chaka Khan is not a church girl.

Jay Ray: She's not a church girl.

Sir Daniel: a church girl. She's not, she does not come from the church. But the way she carries on, you would think she was,

Jay Ray: Yeah.

Sir Daniel: but she is not

Jay Ray: Well,

that's when you, you talk ...Yeah, it's that anointing that you have talked about. Like, um, watching that end refrain of the Colors' performance Through the Fire, I was like, "Are they gonna take this to church right now?" As Chaka leaned right in, dude. You know, she leaned right into the church of it all. And I'm like, "Get it, girl. Get it." Like,

Sir Daniel: If I had a tambourine right now

Jay Ray: if I had a tambourine right now. But so s- a couple of things that we would love to ask all of you to do. Um, if you're hearing this, hearing our voices, go back and revisit the songs that we've talked about. Like, they are all dope, um, in their own way. In particular, revisit Feels Like Heaven. Like Chaka said, that's her favorite duet. W- there is a music video with her and Peter doing this song. Oh, and this is '90s Chaka, and '90s Chaka is kinda like peak Chaka when you c- when you talk about the voice. Um, so it's, it's great stuff, so definitely go and check it out.

[00:36:53] Closing Thoughts

Sir Daniel: Absolutely. Well, we appreciate you taking this trip down Chaka Khan lane with us.

Jay Ray: the other thing that you can do is visit our website at queuepoints.com. And when you visit the website, you can, um, listen to the entire archive of Queue Points episodes, which there are a lot of them to tune into. Subscribe to the show wherever you are. If you can hear our faces and see our voices, just go ahead and hit that subscribe button. Uh, share the show with your friends, family, and colleague 'cause, friends, family, and colleagues, because if you enjoy Queue Points, chances are they will as well. Uh, shop our store at store.queuepoints and check us out on Substack where we have some other dope stuff over there. We appreciate y'all. We love y'all

Sir Daniel: We absolutely do, and if you hear faces and see sounds, we want you down with us. So like I say in every week, in this life, you have a choice. You can either pick up the needle or let the record play. I'm DJ Sir Daniel

Jay Ray: And my name is Jay Ray y'all

Sir Daniel: And this is Queue Points podcast, dropping the needle on Black music history. We will see you on the next go-round

[00:38:03] Outro Theme